The Atlantic - Latest Comments in The Conscience Of A Conservative

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Sime — Mon, 12 Oct 2009 08:13:13 -0000

nobody cares what five Norwegian guys think

Yeah, obviously.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Acromion — Sun, 11 Oct 2009 10:27:51 -0000

The whole theory of anthropogenic global warming was based on flimsy computer models, which are coming under withering attack. The fact is, the Earth's climate has always changed, sometimes rapidly. CO2 levels have likewise fluctuated throughout geological history with no permanent effects on climate.

Unfortunately the whole enterprise has become so heavily politicized its tough to cut through the crap, so I don't blame anyone for freaking out after watching Inconvenient Truth. But what is frightening is that some are prepared to spend countless millions to reduce CO2 emissions by a couple percent without having any solid evidence that it will alter the global climate. This money would be put to much better use solving more concrete environmental problems that will better serve mankind, like protecting clean water sources or reducing heavy metal pollution.

Here are a couple links that will get you started.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124597505076157449.html#articleTabs%3Darticle

http://www.wecnmagazine.com/2007issues/may/may07.html

Come to the Dark Side!!!!

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

drumwolf — Sun, 11 Oct 2009 08:58:52 -0000

I'd say it's more accurate to say they're a ideological cult, not unlike the very same communists that they love to accuse non-conservatives of sympathizing with. And unlike communism, which at least is rooted in unrealistic idealism, American conservatism is essentially rooted in white rage.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

OKay — Sun, 11 Oct 2009 02:52:31 -0000

David Brooks said on the News Hour that "nobody cares what five Norwegian guys" think.

*cringe*

Read more at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/joseph-a-palermo/reaction-to-president-oba_b_316385.html

I have read only 2 articles that point to the Nobel Prize's original intent to fund the future of the recipients as opposed to rewarding lifetime achievements. This seems to be the main fact that so many are ignoring.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

MikeJ — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 23:21:21 -0000

The GOP has morphed into something like a religious sect where the highest priority is saying the words the fellow sectarians approve of, rather than trying to be winsome to the "outside world". If you are a normal person who is offended by the 'affirmative action' comments, then you can be assured that the guy was not addressing you, he was addressing his fellow sect-members.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Hugo Pottisch — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 16:28:19 -0000

I think that Obama's pre-election speech on race was reason enough to give him the Peace Nobel. As Ta-Nahisi has often pointed out - Obama is unique in the way that he can see both sides due to his upbringing and kin. That speech was very different from Megan's (and Malcolm's) claim that liberals and conservatives are all the same... it was more than simple pattern recignition etc. It was great.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Hugo Pottisch — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 16:23:23 -0000

I am travelling through the Middle East myself right now. Muhammed said that urging others to do good is good in itself.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

anna perez — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 16:21:04 -0000

Unlike in comments sections on other blogs, here blanket statements like "global warming is a freakin scam based on crap science" reguire some reasoned explanation and/or maybe a link or two with said explanation. Absent that kind of reasoned discourse, this comments section would be just like...RedStates'. But I bet you knew that.

I can't speak for my fellow commentors, but I like and usually learn from honest, rigorous, informed and reasoned debate. Talking points (from the left or the right) not so much.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

anna perez — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 15:50:13 -0000

The point of TNC's original post was Red State's accusation that the Nobel Prize was awarded to Pres. Obama because of affirmative action. Vaildog, I am interested in your thoughts on that particular point. No straw men allowed.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Jay — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 10:45:51 -0000

That statement shows you are completely unaware of the damage that the US has done to the world for - at least - the last 8 years.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

ladyfresh — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 10:36:59 -0000

GOP: Digging the grave deeper every day.

oh funny, sad but true

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Deborah — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 09:31:53 -0000

Thanks for the international perspective. Anyone able to chime in from Europe on reaction?

One thing I notice having lived abroad is how extremely insular Americans are--we're used to being number one and not caring what the world thinks of us. Either they like us because we're nice people, or they are jealous because we're so cool. Look at the coverage of US affairs in any foreign paper, versus the coverage of world affairs in any US paper. I remember in the buildup to the Iraq War British support for the cause was characterized as "look, the Americans are going to do this whatever we do, but if we're involved we can influence them." Try to imagine the US using that as a criterion to get involved in a war Russia or Japan or Bolivia wanted to start. We're the only superpower--our leadership really does have the power to inspire and depress the world, because what we do will affect the rest of the world.

I still think the award is weird and likely not terribly helpful, but there's a little more than not being GWB involved. It's a window into how much the change in power changed our image abroad, and thereby changed the world's outlook for the future.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Bint California — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 08:23:58 -0000

That might well be. From the Middle East (where I'm sitting right now), it looks a little different. The Obama administration has made a real effort to improve the image of the US here, after years of negative Arabic-language media coverage of Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo, civilian deaths, etc.

And the speech he gave in Cairo was a great start. But the reaction on the street and in the press was, basically - great speech. Thanks. But please do something now to show us that it isn't just words - that your idea of improving the US image around here is more than saying something really nice.

In that respect, the Nobel may not play well. The speech and the administration's policy changes raised expectations so high. And today...the press is pointing to no Israeli settlement freeze, no progress towards Palestinian statehood, etc., and blaming a lack of US resolve. Saying it's all just words.

So now the Europeans give the President the Nobel Peace Prize, which a lot of people around here are reading as saying "Mission Accomplished."

That's not Obama's fault - he didn't ask for the Nobel. The perceived lack of progress on the Israeli-Palestinian front isn't primarily the US's fault either. But the awarding of the prize could make it harder for him to navigate in this part of the world, as the reaction may be pretty sour.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Acromion — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 23:30:19 -0000

Well if I'm ignorant, then you can count me in with the hundreds of other ignorant, credentialed scientists who think human caused climate change is bunk.

Mark my words, we will look back on this global warming craze like people do now with phrenology or mesmerism. And I'm not trolling. I'm serious about this. I don't know why climate change skepticism provokes this knee jerk accusation of ignorance or trolling.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Deborah — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 23:20:02 -0000

Trolling, definitely. Go read the last 10 years of Science News for a quick overview, then come back.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Deborah — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 23:17:26 -0000

I'm not quite sure what Norwegians would have to feel guilty about on American race relations.

For some reason this is the funniest thing I've read all day. Brings up the image of an army of Swedish chefs. Thank you.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Guest — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 22:00:54 -0000

Dave –

You have no business calling me puerile. If you know what the word really means, you know that it is an insult. Puerile means childish, even infintilsh. I won’t try to return the favor; because I strive to be polite as possible on-line and because I appreciate the effort Mr. Coates makes in trying to make his blog a civil environment for all.

Without speaking for Rainy, I’d basically say that she brought up the issue of Republicans and race.

You tried to refute this by bringing up the example of the Republican’s Desmond Tutu’s 1984 Nobel Prize win.

I bring up the fact that the Republicans, from the perspective of the black South Africans…..which was the perspective of the Archbishop after, don’t look all that great. Basically illustrating that the example you brought up isn’t exactly the best one to use if you want to redeem the Republicans over racial issues. That was it, I wasn’t trying to say all Republicans are racists.

You try to rule my entire post irrelevant on several different grounds.

I reply once more, addressing each one of your points, trying to argue the relevance of my original post.

Instead of addressing any of the points I made in rebuttal, you first insult me, saying that I’m being childish. Then you, for all intents and purposes, infer that if I don’t address the one specific point you made, I am rude and trespassing.

Nothing I’ve said is puerile. And you don’t get to have private conversations and set the rules of discussion here. “Inserting myself”? You have some nerve sir. No, you didn’t ask me to reply to you. And Rainy didn’t ask you to reply to her.

But if you wish to continue to insult me on-line, go ahead. Out of respect to Mr. Coates, I will not say another word in this thread, other than to say to Mr. Coates that if he’s feels that I have crossed a line with any of my posts in this thread, I do sincerely apologize.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

donaldball — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 22:00:40 -0000

Wow, son, you got schooled that bad, at least have the good grace to slink out quietly.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

donaldball — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 21:57:08 -0000

You're either ignorant, trolling, or both. Either way, you contribute nothing and in fact detract from the conversation.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Acromion — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 21:27:01 -0000

Global warming is a freakin scam based on crap science. The amount of warming due to CO2 emissions is negligible. Its become like a religion to some people. I really don't get it.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

DaveinHackensack — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 21:08:54 -0000

"I never said that any Republicans claimed that Tutu's award was unjustified. Did I?"

That's what my exchange with Rainy was about -- remember, the one you inserted yourself into? So don't be puerile. And don't act all exasperated that I don't know you did a term paper about South Africa once in school. Moving on...

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

piledhighanddeep — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 20:57:17 -0000

I think if you live in Europe, you feel much safer, much more hopeful about the future than you did a year ago. And that's entirely because of Barack Obama. Approaching problems with diplomacy rather than warmongering must feel especially wonderful to European people about now, and that's why he won.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

Katherine — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 20:46:54 -0000

What causes wars? Greed and ambition, primarily. The Gulf War and the Iraq War were about oil, but nobody forces people to fight wars over oil - people will still want control of important resources regardless of what the global climate does. The World Wars were about dominance and control of global affairs. The Civil War was about slavery. The war in Afghanistan was caused by religious fanaticism and American imperialism.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

CitizenE — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 20:34:18 -0000

What exactly do you think causes wars? Wars are the symptoms of environmental imbalance. That people still don't get that--I'll say it again the Defense Department has made that very point about climate change--is what makes both Gore and the committee of scientists work so important.

Re: The Conscience Of A Conservative

CitizenE — Fri, 09 Oct 2009 20:30:06 -0000

@ Dave--invidious eh? had to look that one up cause it sounded as if you were making some sort of insidious comment about my comment, and given what a hard time I give you, I wanted to know if I were being bad or unfair, casting you into some unfavorable light. If so, I apologize; I have no idea if you have any opinion about Ms. Morrison or not, and I was merely responding to how you often bring up the reverse racism meme, which for me almost always sounds like a dodge, when you have more real and important things to say. However, it was smug, glib, and uncalled for.

My take was and is Pinter impacted the social fabric of the English speaking world, especially Great Britain, on a social level. Naipaul was appreciated by critics and readers.

However, just to assure you, one year the Nobel committee gave the award to that complete commie and the greatest poet of the 20th century, Pablo Neruda, and very year before, they had awarded it to Alexander Solzhenitsyn, perhaps communism's most profound literary critic and the world's greatest novelist of the post WW 2 period. Now you could stick both Pinter and Naipaul in either of those two gentlemen's change pockets and not distinguish them from the lint you might find inside.

To paraphrase the words of Bob Dylan, Gao Xingjian and Dario Fo once unwrapped a bedroll.