The Atlantic - Latest Comments in Roland Burris in effect

Re: Roland Burris in effect

dd — Sat, 10 Jan 2009 11:06:06 -0000

Roland Burris is an idiot listen to him talk. He would have never gotten elected on his own. The reason Roland will be state senator is because the democrats tried to be sneaky and underhanded, they refused to have a special election to replace Obama. The special election is what the majority of people in Illinois wanted. The democrats held a special session and refused the special election. Governor Blagoevich in a sneaky but brillant move appointed Burris as the senator, which he was legally able to do.This is the same democratic party that did little or nothing for the last 4 years and did nothing in regards to the appointment and got scre#####.

Roland Burris is do nothing , bootlicking,pompous weasel, egomanaical midget.( no disrespect to weasels or egomaniacal midgets any where in the world)

Re: Roland Burris in effect

David — Fri, 02 Jan 2009 23:08:03 -0000

I'm black and even i was thoroughly appalled by the Burris appointment. Both he and Rush should be ashamed of themselves for allowing themselves to be used as political pawns in Blago's scheme.

Its obvious they both had the racial card thing planned right from the word go. If not why was Bobby Rush at the press conference and why was he invited to speak?

Burris pls bury your head in shame. You're a disgrace to every black man or woman out there. Being a US senator is a lot more than the color of your skin.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

eltoro — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 17:31:39 -0000

Jackson93,

Nobody is saying that it is logical or fair to view Quinn as being just another Irish machine pol like the Daleys, the Hyneses, the Madigans, the Cullertons, etc. It's just that when you notice how predominant the Irish are in Cook County politics, you tend to be reflexively suspicious of any politician with Irish surnames, if you are not Irish.

I agree with you though that Pat Quinn is clearly not of the same ilk as politicians like Mayor Daley and House Speaker Mike Madigan. He definitely belongs to the non-Machine wing of Chicago politics associated with neighborhoods like Hyde Park (it is of course the wing that Obama hails from). He's the type of politician that Mike Royko would have referred to as a "goo-goo" (i.e. a good government type).

BTW, there is also a divide between the Irish and the white ethnic non-Irish. My former alderman Eddie Vrdolyak once commented that in the minds of Irish pols like Richard Daley, non-Irish pols were all "just Polacks". While Fast Eddie's comment has to be taken with a truckload of salt (he was after all the guy who led the opposition to Harold Washington), there has been the feeling among the Poles, the Germans, the Jews, the Croatians, et cetera, that the Irish always made sure that they got the lion's share of political spoils, even though the non-Irish always greatly outnunbered the Irish. So this resentment toward Irish pols isn't just limited to African-Americans or even Latinos for that matter.

(Of course, the reason why the Irish have dominated machine poltics for so long is that Poles, the Germans, the Croatians, Latinos, and African-Americans distrusted each other so much that they were never able to form political alliances against the Irish. Instead, the Irish often served as the mediator between these groups, and became leaders of the Machine by default.)

Re: Roland Burris in effect

jackson93 — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 12:30:57 -0000

nina s,

I have lived through this. I grew up in Morgan Park, which happens to be neighborhood that is part Black and part Irish Catholic. I know about the Black/Irish divide in Chicago politics, and I don't deny it exists or is at play in general. I was at the south side irish parade holding my Obama sign when he ran for the senate against Dan Hynes and getting harassed by Hynes' supporters. Obama was not allowed to march in the parade, because it was Hynes' neighborhood essentially.

I do not however think that this tension explains peoples' objections to Blagojevich appointing anyone to that seat. This isn't about Burris - this is about a guy who allegedly tried to sell the senate seat and who has abysmal approval ratings choosing our next senator.

Ta-Nehisi,

I take your point about rikyrah explaining what others believe, and I apologize if I was overly harsh. I still would like an explanation of why Quinn is guilty by association though. It still seems like his Irish name is the only connection to the so-called "Irish gang" she keeps referring to.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

Ta-Nehisi Coates — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 11:29:04 -0000

In Rik's defense, I'm pretty certain she was explaining, not defending. I read her post again, after Scott's point. You can disagree with her analysis, but I don't think it's fair to say that her analysis reflects what she--herself--believes.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

nina s. — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 11:24:27 -0000

For those who are jumping on Rikyrah, if you've got a little free time today, listen to this. Harold's story can be a pretty good primer on Chicago politics. The black/Irish Chicago Dem party divide is huge and real. It's not bigotry to note that this shit is still very much at play.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

Persia — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 11:00:05 -0000

sgwhite, I don't know. Maybe he just rubbed me the wrong way. But he didn't seem well-prepared and I didn't like his answers generally-- the thing that sticks out to me is when Rachel asked him if he was going to fight the Congress if they refused to seat him and he refused to give a straight answer. He had to have known he was going to be asked this-- and really, he could've cooked up a pretty good answer. "As a former Attorney General, I feel the law should be followed, etc." But instead he waffled.

There was going to be a huge cloud over anyone Blago appointed. I don't think this guy's the right person to handle the level of scrutiny and pressure. I mean, those campaign donations are pretty mild compared to what Fitzgerald says Blago was asking for-- but he didn't, for whatever reason, come close to making this point and no one else has tried to on his behalf, at least as far as I can tell.

You need to be Superman to get through this, and so far Burris is looking more like Jimmy Olsen.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

jackson93 — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 10:52:35 -0000

rikyrah,

I was born, raised, and still live in Chicago. I don't live in post-racial fantasy land. I am not denying racial and ethnic politics and coalitions.At the same time I don't think that judging people by their last name or ethnicity is productive. Replace the word Irish in your diatribe with the words Jews, Blacks, Asian, or Hispanic, and maybe you'll see what I mean.

I don't see how Pat Quinn is guilty by association - what association? Pat Quinn has often fought against the machine in Illinois. He created things like the Citizens Utility Board so regular people could fight the utilities. He has fought to stop Illinois legislators from inflating their salaries. Just this year he supported a constitutional convention for Illinois. What you are saying is no different than saying "well, he's black so he's just like all the other black politicians." I believe we can address racial and ethnic aspects of politics without condemning entire races or ethnicities.

As for Lisa Madigan, her name and connections definitely helped her get elected, but Jesse jackson Jr. benefited from his name and connection, as did Hillary Clinton (Bill) and Blagojevich (Dick Mell). Connections and recognizable names are nothing new in politics and they sure aren't limited to the Irish. Lisa Madigan was elected though and has done a good job in office as far as I can tell.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

sgwhiteinfla — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 10:40:56 -0000

Persia

You are like the 10th person I have seen say that Burris came off bad last night on Maddow. I didn't catch the show the first time it came on but around 2 am last night I finally caught it. I don't think Burris came off bad at all except for the fact that most people were going to view him coming off bad unless he changed his mind on air and said he was wrong to say yes to begin with. Nothing that he said was wrong. Tone deaf maybe but I wouldn't even say that. He never said that he had wide spread support. In fact he alluded to the obstacles he is facing. He said he had already reached out to Obama but didn't get through. He said he would try to work on Dick Durbin to get his support. He talked about gettting the CBC on board and he kept referring to his 20 years of public service. Not only that he continually brought up the fact that Blago's problems are not his problems. Setting aside for a moment that he himself called for Blago to resign he also pointed out that he backed his removal BUT the Supreme Court dismissed that action when it was before them. You might want to check out the clip again. Dude might be an opportunist but he isn't dumb at least he doesn't appear to be from his Tee Vee appearances yesterday.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

Persia — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 10:26:38 -0000

With all the 'blacks versus Irish' stuff I feel like I'm in a Prohibition speakeasy or something. Oh, Chicago. Never change.

Burris was on Rachel Maddow last night, sounding remarkably clueless and tone deaf.

Does Bobby Rush have health problems? He seemed really...unwell in the clips of the press conference I saw.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

rikyrah — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 10:23:02 -0000

rikyrah

"That adds another level to this political drama"

...and adds another level to the undisputable fact that you are, yourself, a bigot. That's a pretty awful post and I'm suprised TNC hasn't given you the blog version of a smackdown by now.

Please explain to me how my explaining the ethnic political jungle of Illinois makes ME a bigot. Explaining the background of the players, and how this is seen from the Black community, makes ME a bigot.

I don't live in some 'post-racial' fantasy land.

I live in the ethnic political jungle that is Chicago - born and raised in it my entire life.

Telling the truth about the ethnic politics that underly all of this, doesn't make ME a bigot.

Maybe where you live is ethnic Shangri-La.

But, I was born and raised in what has been called ' the most segregated city in America'.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

rikyrah — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 10:17:09 -0000

Rikyrah - is every person of Irish descent evil in your eyes regardless of anything else? Pat Quinn has very little to do with the Irish machine - he is very much on the fringes of the democratic party. But I guess just because his last name is irish he must be bad? That sounds striking close to racism - judging a group of people based not on the content of their character but by their last name.

Actually, no. But, Quinn is guilty by association. You don't have to like the raw ethnic politics, but to sit and deny it, maybe you have that kind of ability. I live here. I see it. I have to live under the results of it everyday. I don't live in post-racial fantasy land. I live in the ethnic political jungle of Illinois, where folks get over everyday because of their last name and connections....:Lisa Madigan:...cough..cough...

Re: Roland Burris in effect

jackson93 — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 10:00:01 -0000

"I know its still fresh from just a few hours ago but going crazy over it won't help anything."

sgwhiteinfla,

I don't think objecting to Blagojevich appointing *anyone* to the senate seat is "going crazy." I don't think it's crazy to want your senator to be viewed as legitimate by other senators. I am not expecting anyone senator to change the world or become president (although I would note that Illinois' most recent junior senator is doing just that). I just want someone who will be respected and be able to fully represent me and my state in the senate. And I feel I must restate that my objection is not to Burris specifically but to the fact that Blagojevich appointed anyone at all. It feels like a giant screw you to the state and the democrats.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

Scott — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 09:34:52 -0000

-K1

"I know there some disimilarities with the analogy, but you get my point. Sometimes you take opportunities anyway they come."

You're admitting that you have a lack of moral values with that statement. Or, if you do, you have no reflex to follow them.

-sgwhteinfla

"But hell man like I said if the Illinois Dems woulda had some courage and pushed for the special election none of this shit would have or could have happened."

That's the crux of the issue, isn't it? Hell, even Helmet-Head (Blogo) pointed that out and he was 100% correct.

-rikyrah

"That adds another level to this political drama"

...and adds another level to the undisputable fact that you are, yourself, a bigot. That's a pretty awful post and I'm suprised TNC hasn't given you the blog version of a smackdown by now.

-southpaw

"I'm willing to dismiss Rush's comments, but only to the extent we agree that leveraging this country's tortured history for tactical gain is just harmless political mischief."

We'll remember that the next time some idiot white politician, or, God forbid, a nationally syndicated morning show host, makes a "harmless" racially-themed statement and then looses his job over it. While I respect your opinion on the matter, calling it harmless seems less than naive a not a little condescending.

-mumbles

*APPLAUSE* That should be overarching way of looking at this.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

TRW — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 09:30:09 -0000

Okay---I have come back to comment with evidence to prove my point about the absurdity of this whole thing. As I said in my previous post, I highly doubt (but could be wrong) if Rush would have stepped up to the plate for this appointment if the dude being appointed wasn't his kind of Black man. Case in point: On December 9th, Rush said this about an appointment "Any person appointed by Mr. Blagojevich would be 'as tainted as can be' and would be in danger of losing the seat in 2010."

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/dec/09/rush-opposes-durbins-call-special-election/

So, now, not only has Rush changed his tune, but he has the audacity to say that anybody who raises the same concerns about this appointment that he did just a couple of weeks ago, is basically a racist that wants to block a Black man from serving in the Senate. Give me a freakin' break. This guy has NO credibility, NONE. And neither does Burris. In my mind, the fact that Burris is so power hungry that he would willingly let himself be used by Blago to gain power in the Senate makes him suspect to me. I don't care how clean his background is.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

Uncular1 — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 08:08:19 -0000

TNC,

But if we get rid of the race card what will the children exchange during Post-racial appreciation day at school?? ;)

Re: Roland Burris in effect

MDA — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 06:16:45 -0000

Burris is the Alan Keyes of the Dems. Totally without credibility.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

lever — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 06:02:35 -0000

NOT (so NOT) to hijack the thread? But, your initial statement re: "the shortsightedness of grown men" pulled me in.

Uh, Mr. Coates??!

DON'T.GET.ME.STARTED.ON.THAT.TOPIC.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

Petra — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 04:08:15 -0000

Why is this man so 'undesirable' to the Democratic party? Wouldn't the 'graceful' thing to be to find out his views on (a) the war (b) UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE (c) economy (d) transportation?

The 'biggies' are that this guy made more than one contribution to Blago...however, many 'contributions' were made to all other candidates as well.

Also, as this man is a lobbyist...scrutiny should be paid to specific issues he lobbied for.

I would like to know: HOW COME HE HAD A $300,000 'GRANT' FROM THE TRANSPORTATION DEPARTMENT (STATE OF ILLINOIS)?

If I lived in Illinois, I would certainly wonder about this---espcially since a Republicon dignitary from Illinois has been appointed Secretary of TRANSPORTATION.

$300,000 would purchase a lot of transportation rides for the poor---those who are still employed, that is!

Certainly, this would be a more 'grass' roots use of ILLINOIS funds--than giving it to a billionaire lobbyist. (YES, this is a VERY rich man...having made a fortune in commercial mid-west Real Estate!

Re: Roland Burris in effect

eltoro — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 03:16:17 -0000

"Burris would not keep the Senate seat if there was a referendum. By taking it from Blago he has tainted himself beyond belief. He has no idea of what is going to happen to him. The press and public are going to eat this egomaniac for breakfast, brunch, lunch, dinner and a late night snack."

Irish Pirate,

I think Burris knows very well what is going to happen to him and doesn't care. In fact, because he has such an ego, he will enjoy even the negative attention that that the local and national media will bring his way. Burris hasn't had this level of attention paid to him in six years, and the egomaniac in him will enjoy every minute of it.

Despite Blago's taint, I think a bare majority of Illinois voters will give Burris the benefit of the doubt because of his decent record of public service. Burris, however, will actually have to perform well in office once he is actually seated, if he has any ambitions to stay in the office past the next election, special or general.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

husseinfistbump — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 02:27:59 -0000

I feel a certain sympathy for anyone who constructs what he obviously wants to be an imposing mausoleum, but ends up creating a rather clunky stone bus-shelter instead. "Look on my works, ye mighty, and despair".... But then, I come to bury Burris, not to praise him.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

mumbles — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 02:15:40 -0000

Me next!

I see a narrow race angle in this. Burris will be the sixth black senator in the history of the United States. And that number really is pathetically low. It's the sort of number that guys like Bobby Rush will...uh...rush up to defend. They love the "head count" concept.

I don't. I hate the idea of the sixth black senator in US history being appointed by a corrupt governor, to help him in his inevitable trial. Everyone needs to do better than this.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

IrishPirate — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 01:35:30 -0000

Burris would not keep the Senate seat if there was a referendum. By taking it from Blago he has tainted himself beyond belief. He has no idea of what is going to happen to him. The press and public are going to eat this egomaniac for breakfast, brunch, lunch, dinner and a late night snack.

I was born in Chicago and yesterday I witnessed perhaps the only politician in Illinois more narcissistic than Blago step to the podium

Then Bobby Rush was the third clown to exit the clown car at this circus we call Blagoworld.

Impeach the man, TODAY.

If you doubt Burris is a nutjob take a look at some of the links to his "tombstone" in Oakwoods Cemetery.

http://wonkette.com/405196/roland-burris-has-already-constructed-his-terrifying-death-chamber#comments

Playing the race card in this issue is despicable. Burris and Rush should know better. Then again Burris is an egomaniac and Rush is sick with cancer and was never the brightest bulb in the Chicago political world.

I'm a Chicago Democrat. Born and bred. The only time I supported Republicans was when the democratic candidates were so corrupt and incompetent that I had no other choice. Don't blame me. I voted for Vallas in 2002 and Judy Topinka in 2006.

I hope Obama "bigfoots" Burris into retirement very quickly. Of course Burris has done quite well off state contracts recently.

I hope Jesse White, our black Secretary of State, holds his ground and refuses to certify Burris.

Re: Roland Burris in effect

drugs bunny — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 00:56:07 -0000

i like this pick. i just wish blago was gone, and quinn had made it.

roland burris is good peoples who, as others have noted, repeatedly won statewide offices as comptroller and attorney general. when he ran for governor, he was screwed repeatedly in close democratic primaries by glenn poshard and dawn clark netsch, who each went on to defeat in the general election.

i think illinois should get a referendum on whether or not to have a special election. (but we don't do those non-election years, right? damn.) i bet if there was a referendum on keeping burris, he'd keep his seat. folks around here remember the man as honest, ethical and intelligent, if a bit boring on the stump. yes please! (lifelong rogers park/chicago resident, by the way. of the caucasian persuasion, if anyone cares.)

Re: Roland Burris in effect

DougEMI — Wed, 31 Dec 2008 00:29:04 -0000

The awful thing for someone like Burris is that under normal circumstances, his appointment would make perfect sense. He is a lifelong pol who fills the role of interim Senator until some new blood comes along. Instead, he ends up like an interim coach of a shitty football team that is going to be placed on probation.

No matter how clean the guy has been, he ends up getting his job because he is the preferred candidate of America's most corrupt Governor.