The Atlantic - Latest Comments in On apologies

Re: On apologies

Susan Phalen — Mon, 08 Sep 2008 11:34:39 -0000

Thank you for this incredibly well-written discussion, which I shared with my college-level HS class. Keep up the amazing work!

Re: On apologies

allbetsareoff — Sat, 06 Sep 2008 13:02:10 -0000

No one with two brain cells to rub together doubts that Republicans play the politics of racial polarization. A few, such as Lee Awater shortly before death, occasionally admit it.

But no GOPer that I know of has ever admitted that what people like Westmoreland are really after is outrage from the media and Democrats. There are votes to be mined from casting Republicans as the party of whites and Democrats as the party of minorities.

It's a filthy tactic, but until it's demonstrated to be a loser they'll keep employing it.

Re: On apologies

Hassan — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 23:30:04 -0000

real recognize real, keep doing you.

Re: On apologies

Rod Hoffman — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 23:12:45 -0000

I respect you for your apology, especially because most would say its not necessary to apologize for a minor infraction. It demonstrates that you are more self-aware than most.

My insight on this topic: Some years back, my wife and I took a "How to be Married" class. It was worth it for this single insight. "Any 'apology' that includes the word "if", "but" or "because" is not an apology; it is an excuse."

I'm on 25 years and counting.

Re: On apologies

MB — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 20:06:40 -0000

Honesty is the best we can ask for, in this case. If more people would be honest about their meanings and feelings around these matters, the better off we'd be. Lynn Westmoreland's bullsh** claim today about the meaning of "uppity" will work for him (click my name for a link to why it's absolutely a lie) because this is an area in which we all expect dishonesty, and straight up racists like him can exploit that.

Re: On apologies

rab — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 18:57:38 -0000

As a republican, I wish people like that were (metaphorically) thrown in a river and never heard from again as politicians by our party. WTF? How can somebody 1) say what he said; 2) not apologize? 3) Not be immediately censured. Either way, love the post. I think a lot of people go through the screed phase, and hopefully grow out of it, although very few will ever write as well or as reflectively as Coates.

Re: On apologies

Penny — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 18:12:31 -0000

I just donated to Stephen Camp, who as you know is Lynn Westmoreland's opponent, in your honor. I am a liberal, female, white St. Paul, Minnesota resident. Although St. Paul is overwhelmingly DFL (that's what we call it here: the Democrat Farmer Labor Party), we welcomed the Republican Convention with open arms. Now I am ashamed we hosted that scumfest. All I can do in penance is send money- to Senator Obama after Governor Palin's hateful performance, and now to Stephen Camp. I encourage others to do the same.

Re: On apologies

kid bitzer — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 15:15:51 -0000

i am very impressed by this post.

you have my deepest respect for the sentiments and attitude you expressed here, and for the code of communication you preach and practice.

my hat is off.

Re: On apologies

Fred — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:35:28 -0000

Out of respect for T-N C's request not to derail, don't respond this question here, Chris, but in the next relevant thread T-N provides, tell me which issues you feel you win on and why.

Re: On apologies

Galen Kim Davis — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 14:31:10 -0000

I thought the apology was graceful. Funny how the evangelicals have become more visible and so many in the public behave with so little grace.

Re: On apologies

Bill Harshaw — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:40:39 -0000

I'm not sure your strength is recognizing reality--"I did a lot of that when I was young,"??

What do you think you are now? Just a young whippersnapper who can sling the verbs. Enjoy your youth while you have it.

Re: On apologies

Randy — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:25:52 -0000

Great, now you have me thinking about personal growth stuff.

A true apology, and this is what you did, is a statement that you acted in a way that you think is beneath you, not in keeping with how you see yourself and how you want yourself to behave in thsi world. It has very little to do with the other party.

It is not the "I am sorry if anyone has been offended" false political apology.

It is a statement that I have offended myself, and I am sorry for that. And that is a position of strength, of strengthening, of improving yourself.

That is why Major Winchester in the M*A*S*H* tv series asked his parents to send him deoderant. He was offending himself, and could not stand it.

Taking the high road is difficult, and keeping to it even more so. But I would prefer to lose an election than call my oponent the toad-sucking tree-drilling nastertium-kicking person that she is. But I have gone too far and apoligize to anyone who may think that they should have been offended by what I said.

Re: On apologies

Ta-Nehisi Coates — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:15:06 -0000

Real Fred and Chris,

Please don't derail. No offense, but this is why people start their own blogs.

Re: On apologies

Patrick — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:13:44 -0000

I'm still amazed that there's all this contention over what was really a pretty bland burn.

Re: On apologies

RobFightmaster — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:12:46 -0000

TNC,

This sentiment is true and good. Hold on to it.

Re: On apologies

JC — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:11:50 -0000

For the most part, I do agree. What is EFFECTIVE, is a more important question, than the normal bitching sessions.

The thing is, what to do when one feels outrage, that is effective? Reverend Kind and others, never gave into screeds of self-righteousness, mostly, because they didn't expect good behavior, and also realized it was ineffective.

We middle class whites though, think that our outrage is justified. Take a look at Krugman, Delong, regular moderates, initially driven crazy by the lying and crimes of this administration.

Of course, as you say - outrage is easy. Just look at how the right wing borg uses it, and gets in a manic frenzy.

So for the most part, you are correct. Calm and clear eyed, is the best, even when you see something that is obviously outrageous, you respond in a more useful way, than a narcissistic way.

Re: On apologies

AndrewN — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:09:51 -0000

I didn't think I could enjoy your blog any more than I already do--and now you've gone and done it!

Seriously. I love it. Don't ever sell out?

Re: On apologies

Doctor Jay — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:09:17 -0000

As a club, "jump in a river" is more of a nerf bat. Nevertheless, I see your point.

I once read a conservative commenter who remarked that the Lord of the Rings movies had reminded him of the importance of fighting evil. To me, though, I thought the message of LoTR was that what was important was *how* you fought evil.

Fight with faith and confidence. Obama seems to be going for an actual mandate. Win big, win for his policies, or don't win at all. Such confidence I haven't seen in a Democratic politician for a long time.

We need to let go of our fears, and stick to our agenda. Sarah Palin is meant to distract us from noticing that the Republican Party has nothing to offer America. They aren't even trying to be serious about dealing with our biggest problems.

Re: On apologies

Guest — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:00:52 -0000

Real Fred: I think my advice to Fake Fred is still valid for you.

http://www.floppingaces.net/2008/07/01/semi-literate-michelle-obama-got-by-on-affirmative-action/

Okay, google "Michelle Obama" and affirmative action and tell my why it is that we are supposed to apologize to these people again? We win on the issues. I don't care how many buckets of crocodile tears they shed when we vet the candidate they love despite never having heard of her six days ago. Their culture of "victimization when it's convenient" is truly disgusting and is a continuation of the well-worn hypocrisy which, quite frankly, I'm sick of even having to point out.

Re: On apologies

DougEFresh — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 12:37:45 -0000

That's a kind of writing that pleases me and people who agree with me, but shows absolutely no regard to people who either don't agree, or aren't decided. I have no idea why anyone would want to write in such a fashion. It's arrogant, self-absorbed, and better suited to one's diary, or their inane, half-drunk, happy-hour ramblings.

I read this blog to learn, to challenge my beliefs and get a point of view that is free from the insults that emanate from the echo chamber blogs. I understand that people get frustrated and want their beliefs reinforced and their anger justified, but that gets old real fast. It is kind of like eating a frozen pizza at 2:00 AM when you are drunk. It satisfies at the time, but when you are sober, it isn't a balanced meal and it doesn't taste so good.

If you are ever in Detroit, I will supply the happy hour beer, you provide the ramblings.

Re: On apologies

Persia — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 12:16:13 -0000

I understand where you're coming from, and I appreciate that you're classy enough to apologize. Still don't think you needed to, necessarily, though. I read blogs as reflecting the emotions and reactions of the blogger-- and your comment certainly did that. I guess I'd put it in the same category as typos.

And I still think anyone whining about Palin-- while ignoring crap like 'uppity'-- can jump in a lake. That may be part of it too.

Re: On apologies

Ml — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 12:13:25 -0000

This is why your site is the first one I bring up in the morning, and last one I read at the end of the day. Well put.

Re: On apologies

livius — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 12:07:10 -0000

Beautifully put. I understand why some people felt your apology was a kind of retreat, but as someone with a temper kept in check solely by a gossamer thread of superego, I know firsthand that apologies for an outburst of anger are about setting yourself right internally, ensuring your behavior is congruent with your own standards, not genuflecting to whatever vileness provoked the fury.

Every day I dig you more. The Atlantic is lucky as hell to have you.

Re: On apologies

Hamburger Helper — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 12:05:49 -0000

Wow. Big respect. That was some real shit.

Knowledge reigns supreme over nearly everybody

Call up TNC - guarenteed to rock the party.

Bloggers act like they don't know.

Re: On apologies

justin case — Fri, 05 Sep 2008 12:03:46 -0000

Right on. Well said. We need more of this, not less, in our discourse.