The Atlantic - Latest Comments in Against the machines

Re: Against the machines

Chet — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 11:02:29 -0000

Also, there is no verb "to parent".

In Modern English we verb nouns. Don't be one of those anti-modern throwbacks who tries to force Latin grammar on English. We split infinitives, double negatives, and noun verbs. The people who say that we can't say that because you can't in Latin, and it was fashionable for about 300 years to pretend like English was based on Latin, and that Latin was "better" and its grammar should inform English, but it's simply not true.

Re: Against the machines

Nina — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 10:44:24 -0000

Computers are stupid.

Man-purses aren't (I'm writing from Japan, where they are epidemic).

I use facebook purely for political propaganda, and keeping an eye on/communicating with my teenage cousins, and it works just fine for that.

Re: Against the machines

cd — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 07:57:30 -0000

And I'm amped up, they locked the champ up, even my brain's in handcuffs

Re: Against the machines

Rosali — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 07:49:23 -0000

Sounds like you need a man-purse.

Re: Against the machines

James O'Hearn — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 03:48:28 -0000

Another senseless case of WWD

Writing While Drunk

Shame...

Re: Against the machines

Patrick D — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 02:24:51 -0000

LOL. Mm hm. Been there. And lets see how long til you're happily slidin' your finger along an iphone screen...

Also re: facebook, there is a nice block feature that allows you to trim the friend bush without the branches necessarily knowing the dif. Just sayin.

Re: Against the machines

barb — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 01:56:35 -0000

About that cell phone, maybe I'm hopelessly old fashioned, but I remember back toward the beginning of the century there was a day when a lot of very sad phone calls were made to loved ones from people who had good reason to believe they were about to die on a plane or in a falling building. I realized that if a call like that were made to me, I'd want to be able to take it then and there. So I took the (for me) big step of replacing a perfectly good but bulky cell phone with one that was small enough that I could have it with me all the time. (Yes, I know--many readers don't remember cell phones that were too big to fit easily in a pocket, but I had one then).

Of course, the fact that I don't give the number to very many people, and I don't make many calls with it, means that I often forget to turn it back on after a "cell-phone-off" event, and I forget to charge it a lot. So I wouldn't say I'm really all that well covered against missing a vital call.

But if tech gadgets have trouble staying with you, you might try something like zreturn, which supplies labels to put on them so that finders can return gadgets to their owners. (Apparently, many people are actually willing to do this if it doesn't take too much effort--I know I am.) I started with this after I got up and left a digital camera in a restaurant and didn't realize until the next day, when I was on the other side of the state. You're right, brains are not intended to keep track of all that stuff.

Re: Against the machines

G in Korea — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 01:30:41 -0000

How do you leave facebook? It's very difficult to leave.

Re: Against the machines

MoeLarryAndJesus — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 23:54:15 -0000

DrDave writes: "I am forcing my wife to loosen the leash on our 13 year old son. He needs to start making more decisions and take responsibility for their outcomes. 'Cause we aren't going to be here forever."

I know people who need babysitters when their 15 year old kids would otherwise be "home alone." I respectfully suggest that any 15 year old who doesn't have MAJOR mental problems or physical issues and can't be left alone for a few hours has clinging dipshits for parents.

Re: Against the machines

DrDave — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 22:59:50 -0000

Am I the only one who thinks that most kids today are quivering, over-protected veal?

No. Kids today, at least suburban kids, have no street sense and fewer survival skills. They are coddled, protected and never allowed to scratch their knees.

And my wife and I are as guilty as any other suburban parents. Although I am forcing my wife to loosen the leash on our 13 year old son. He needs to start making more decisions and take responsibility for their outcomes. 'Cause we aren't going to be here forever.

Re: Against the machines

sam t. — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 20:54:36 -0000

Sporcupine and all the other parents who believe your children must have a cell phone for whatever reason you have constructed [safety, your kid's pressure, 'what if something happens?', etc.] Here is some news.

I'm a child psychologist and work with both kids and parents. About 50% of my practice centers on behavioral problems associated with cell phones. Anxious parents, kids who demand cell phones because all their friends have them, kids who are very angry with their parents because they feel they are not trusted, kids who use phones in school, in class, in the bathroom, and the trouble they subsequently get in to, kids who must inform their parents of their location each time they move, just to name a few issues. Cell phones have created hyper-anxious parents and angry kids. Of course, a parent's job description includes some degree of anxiety, and every kid gets pissed at his/her parents when they want to know what they are doing, but cell phones have turned the developmental and manageable child/parent issues into damaging psychological struggles. There is a growing body of research regarding this problem, and, if you are interested in this issue, you should find out more.

Someone mentioned the cell phone acting as an "electronic leash." Yesterday a 14 young kid in my office was screaming and crying at her parents for keeping her "on a leash, just like our dog!" This is new terrain and parents have to be very careful how they navigate it.

As an aside, I never bring my cell phone with me except for special reasons, e.g., long trip away, vacations, etc. I used to carry one with me all the time as did my wife until I found that the only time my wife was calling me was when I was grocery shopping and she called to add things to the grocery list. The result was that I would spend and 45 minutes looking for Pepsi One. And then i realized that the only time I was calling my wife was to let her know I was leaving work. The result of that was that she would get anxious if i stopped on the way home to stop and pick up the mail or stopped at my brother's house as I drove by.

Now, I have a pay as you go cell phone plan and it costs about $12/month as opposed to our 'family talk plan' that cost about $120/month and everyone is very happy. Then there is the danger of talking on the cell while driving...

The Kindle. I have had mine for a year. I haven't read this much in years. For some reason, it is easier on my eyes, my reading speed is faster, and it has features that I haven't even started to explore. It downloads books using cell phone technology at any location that can get a signal. I can store hundreds of books on it, I subscribe to 2 newspapers that are downloaded automatically in the very early morning so that when I wake up, there they are. I don't have to pay a cent for the cell phone connection, and the cost of a book that usually costs $35-$40, costs $10. It pays for itself in savings after about 12 books and it weighs about 6 ounces or so. If you read you should get one.

That's it. Good night and good luck.

Six days until The Day of Truth.

Re: Against the machines

JC — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 20:07:53 -0000

TNC,

Get yourself the I-Phone. You will never go back. I probably use my 'cellphone' portion of the i-phone 1/10 as much as I use it for all the other stuff.

Of course, if you LOSE the phone, well, you're screwed...

Re: Against the machines

Asher — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 20:05:09 -0000

Well wherever you go. Phones are meant to be replaced. If you don't lose them, they come out with better phones and make you feel the "need" to trade up. Fortunately there are always good deals on phones.

Re: Against the machines

Ta-Nehisi Coates — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 19:26:45 -0000

"Say you're at your Atlantic conference in Aspen..."

LOL.

Re: Against the machines

Asher — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 19:15:49 -0000

Yeah, keep your cell phone. You have a kid, and a partner. And I know that people back in the day got along without cell phones, and you can probably be reached most of the time at your Atlantic offices (or wherever you do your work), but emergencies happen. Say you're at your Atlantic conference in Aspen, and something happens - don't you want to be notified as soon as you can, not whenever you get back to your hotel?

Re: Against the machines

Tony Comstock — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 18:19:57 -0000

Also, there is no verb "to parent".

Re: Against the machines

Deborah — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 18:16:30 -0000

On parenting and cell phones--for me it's a convenience, not a necessity. We first got a cell when my husband was going to be near daycare, with the car, but not by a phone; I was going to be far from daycare, without a car. If someone had to pick up a sick kid, much better the parent who was 8 minutes away with transport but might be in a meeting or lab.

I think the extent of electronic leashing of kids is ridiculous; however, it is a real convenience to be able to say "call when you're done" rather than all the waiting around for kid to finish on freezing soccer field that being the parent-at-home usually entails. You can keep that cell at the level of optional convenience, but it takes some effort not to depend on it. (My husband has gone over completely, and is one of those men in stores calling every few aisles to ask which type of pasta the list means.)

Cell phone dependence story: we were visiting a relative who lives on the water and my daughter and her friends wanted to row over to the island. We said okay, but there were no other boats in the water, so if something went wrong they'd need to solve it themselves. "We have our cell phones!" piped up one preteen. After making sure that all 3 grasped telephoning us was going to achieve nothing, they made the trip, had a lovely time, and felt more independent. The only way for kids to feel more independent and capable is to actually be so.

Re: Against the machines

Juba — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 18:02:24 -0000

Well, at least you spared me some humble pie, which I would undoubtedly have been fed by a certain Cowgirls fan following that very winnable 13-9 road loss. What a poor offensive display--Im sick of watching our defense hand the offense a sumptuous win on a silver platter only to watch them scrape it straight into the trash. >:o(

Re: Against the machines

T Harris — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 17:58:41 -0000

Last comment- the only drawback to the kindle is no graphic novels. I haven't found any place in Paris that I can buy trade paperbacks, so I am missing my stories!

But even with that limitation it's amazing! Totally worth the money if you are a bookworm or speedreader (I found a good trilogy this weekend and read the whole thing- no need to go to five bookstores to find all the books in the series, BIG plus).

Even my Mom wants a Kindle- for Christmas, natch.

Re: Against the machines

T Harris — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 17:54:20 -0000

My kindle is my FAVORITE gadget- and I am not really a gadget person or an early adapter.

I could not live without it- but I am a consultant and I live on the road. When I left my last client I had to buy another bag for all the books I bought AND my original bag was an additional 15 pounds overweight (I buy hardcovers because I am really hard on my books as a rule). Thank God the company sent a car to pick me up when I landed, because lugging that stuff to the airport was brutal!

My kindle saves me from all of that.

Best. Purchase, Ever.

Re: Against the machines

MoeLarryAndJesus — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 17:39:40 -0000

The all-encompassing paranoia of the "parents need a cellphone" notion is sort of creepy. Am I the only one who thinks that most kids today are quivering, over-protected veal?

Re: Against the machines

Tony Comstock — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 17:20:47 -0000

I've been a parent for nearly nine years now. I can't say that having a cell phone has been an indispensable part of being a parent.

I will say that an indispensable part of being an adult is weening yourself of the idea you need to be available by phone, e-mail, whatever, 24/7.

Re: Against the machines

kid bitzer — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 16:57:02 -0000

whoa--no cell phone?

now *that's* a bad idea.

if you're a parent, you have to have a cell-phone. your kids and your partner are all going to need to get in touch with you. or the school will. or the parent of their playdate or whichever house they're over at. that stuff is important--you have to be available.

i mean, facebook, sure, dump that shit. it's a timewaster, and doesn't make you a better parent.

but a cell-phone? that's not a luxury item or a toy. it's a way of being responsible to your family.

Re: Against the machines

lisa — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 16:39:49 -0000

Well, to quote Betts from "Mad Men", it must be nice to be able to do that. Dad.

Re: Against the machines

walter — Tue, 28 Oct 2008 16:34:46 -0000

big changes coming. we made a mistake. access to credit isn't wealth, it's debt. now comes the shift. cell fone? get rid of it or get a pay as you go plan. can you hear me now? damn. how about now? why the fuck do you have to check in all the time? who cares where we are? we are on our way.

the gilded age of gadgetry is gone. iPods, iTouches, iPhones, iMe's, gps's [read a fuckin' map], are the toys the big boys convinced us we needed.

a laptop. okay. replaces mail, encyclopedia, sears catalog.

a kindle. okay. replaces heavy books. but it encourages us to read. we all need to read books, not snippets of mini-info. if they can converge kindle, and laptop, that would be fine. if a kindle can get people to read the $300 is worth it. the days of 13 year old kids carrying 50 pound bookpacks should go and be replaced by an 8 oz. kindle.

time to separate wheat from the chaff.